Saturday, January 5, 2013

Defiant county official refuses to hand over list of gun owners to newspaper | Fox News

     The lines are in the sand in Putnam County where the feisty county clerk is refusing to grant a newspaper request for the names and addresses of gun permit owners such was done in two neighboring counties.
      The publishing of what seemingly is in the public record has caused a furor with gun owners claiming their privacy is breached and such information may make them a target for crime.
     Local pols are pledging to "pass a law" to stop such releases.
     The Journal News is insisting they want the list and experts say they likely would prevail if they spend some lawyer time fighting it.
      With circulation dropping, will this just alienate potential readers or is a public interest served by bringing attention to permit holders ?
      There are all sorts of public record items newspapers routinely pass over...Things like bankruptcies, judgments, traffic tickets, divorces (they do a list but not the particulars), health violations, building code violations, police calls to a home....the list goes on and on.
     These things get mentioned if there is a nexus to a crime or sometimes if it's an elected official as they have diminished expectations of privacy.
       The Putnam clerk has become a here in FOX world although the story will likely get little play elsewhere. In fact, the clerk may be intentionally disregarding the law, and is that right ?
       For the paper, it may be a matter of journalistic hubris at this point.
       I know it's not a fight any NNY media would take on.
Defiant county official refuses to hand over list of gun owners to newspaper | Fox News


Anonymous said...

I always want to see a picture of alleged sex crime victims but they only oblige if it is the Sheriff's department doing it. We statistically know that 60 to 70 percent of rapes never actually happened so it makes more sense to print pictures of the "victims" than the accused.

I want more information on suicides too.

Anonymous said...

This is a disgusting act by the newspaper.
I have never been in favor of taking the FOI to such an extreme when it invades peoples right to privacy.
How about a list of all abortions or medical procedures paid for with government money?

Printing government workers salaries is just as bad. It is one thing to disclose a key position and the salary, or a typical salary. But it should be private as to who holds every single job and every single salary.

Part of their salary is medical insurance. Should we be told how much they used of that too?

Anonymous said...

Kudos to Putnam County Clerk!!!

Anonymous said...

A list of gun owners in a newspaper is exactly what a thief wants. Now that thief can go to the addresses and steal the guns without having to search a random home.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...

“Jack Bonner Advocates not registering your Assault Weapons with NYS”

I attended a public forum meeting at the Watertown NY Dulles State building last night sponsored by a local businessman named Jack Bonner, owner of JSL Communications, to discuss school security, mental health and firearm issues. At the meeting Mr. Bonner advocated that Assault weapon owners not register their weapons with NYS, because soon NYS will likely want to confiscate those weapons, and if NYS doesn’t know you own an ‘Assault Weapon’ they can’t take them back if once the new laws are passed.

He ended the meeting by saying that if Government is on your doorstep, I’ll be there to fight it out with you, against any government attempting to take your guns back. If Mr. Bonner is to be believed Government seizure of weapons is likely to cause and armed insurrection. They’ll fight it out if it's the only way to keep NYS’s Gov. Cuomo and the Federal Government from carrying out a weapons confiscation program; after passage of new 'Gun Control' laws.

Also sitting in on the panel were Supt. of Watertown Schools, Terry N. Fralick, and former candidate for Sheriff Charles F. “Chuck” Ruggiero. These openly ultra Conservative types led the meeting and didn’t exactly make Progressives like myself feel welcome; but neither did they discourage me from attending, I shook both Mr. Bonner’s an Mr. Ruggiero’s hand introducing myself to them. I was denied the few minutes I had been promised to speak at an open Mic for the purpose of stating the case for ‘Gun Control’ legislation now.

A large portion of the meeting did focus on School Gun Control issues and what actions were being taken by Supt. Terry Fralick to beef up school security. Very little from what I could gather –there will not going to be armed security in every school, and Mr. Fralick said that ‘Unions’ prevented him from having armed Teachers in Watertown Schools.

Parents at the meeting remain very disturbed that students in Watertown Schools are not being adequately protected, and too little is being done by Mr. Fralick to beef up Security. I suggested he hold open meetings and take direct suggestions on how to accomplish better School security in Watertown Schools, but he made no commitment to do so at this meeting.

After over two hours it was time to end the meeting and I tell you now Mr. Bonner and others in attendance believe it is going to come down to a war with local, State or federal authorities to hang on to gun owners assault weapons once Gov. Cuomo and the Federal Government pass gun control legislation. I don’t think this is an idle threat, they believe it to their inner cores.

Mike Flynn ‘Middle class Mike’

Anonymous said...

Its been two plus onths since the election for Congressman..
What great deed has Matt Doheny done to date to help the people of NNY..
I heard for two years how much he had done and would do from the mayor of Watertown now I would simply like an answer..Has he donated any time to any chairty or given any money to a good cause or is he talking of giving some public service in the near future.. Pleas answer

Anonymous said...

2:33PM - I know Matt Doheny personally and I can assure you that he does more than most in the way of sharing his hard earned success with people that need and deserve help. Now that he is not in public life, that is his business not yours. I think he is better off not in Congress so that he does not have to answer to low IQs like yours. What have you done lately - Mr. Righteous?

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...

I mistakingly thought Bart Bonner's formal name was Jack Bonner - I apologise for calling him Jack Bonner out of respect to what I thought was his formal name. but I've been told it is actually Bart Bonner. MCM

Anonymous said...

Mikey, again your hormones and hysteria are flowing out your mouth. You cry that someone says we shouldn't register certain rifles. Mikey, NYS law does not require anything be registered except handguns. Please wipe. You mouth.

It is just this kind of Mikey Mouth statement that will cause divisive and counterproductive responses to what has happened. We need to listen to each other a bit and come up with ways that will EFFECTIVELY address security issues. We do not need to trample rights, scream hyterically, leave puddles under our pants, and attempt to use this crime as an excuse to get something over on others. Mikey, get hold of yourself. Psychologically that is.

Anonymous said...

The reason you were not allowed to speak is because most folks up here don't want to hear you clear your throat of that left leaning flem you spew each time you open your mouth.

Do us a big favor and clear your throat before you decide to call the mayors show.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...

ANON 11:14PM

You're clearly the one with the hormone problem. I totally relaxed, Gov. Cuomo is going to ban Assualt weapons and introduce the toughest registration laws in the Country -so not to worry. A little helpful information below for your type of 'Gun Nut' might be helpful, I recommend reading the whole report.

Two excerpts below from Yale Law’s Danial Abrams ‘Policy Review”

B. Registration
Similarly, legislation requiring weapon registration seems unlikely to substantially reduce the number of weapons. Registration of assault weapons has two primary purposes: to monitor the prevalence of the weapons in private possession and to link a suspect to a crime if a weapon is found. A registration requirement would be less effective at reducing crime directly than in aiding in the apprehension of suspects by tracking the origin of their guns. There is always the possibility that a criminal would be less likely to use a weapon with a registration number for fear of ultimately being linked to the weapon; but this, of course depends upon how the weapon was obtained. Registration laws are also difficult to enforce absent a herculean effort, [57] and are generally ineffective as crime-fighting tools. Consequently, crime reduction per se may be an unrealistic goal of registration legislation.

The limited utility of registration laws nonetheless, argues for, not against, banning particular weapons. Making any sale or possession of the semiautomatic assault weapons illegal would eliminate the opportunity to obtain the weapons legally and at the same time remove the implicit legality of those weapons (which may lead people to dismiss "mere" registration laws). Because such weapons have been deemed legal, registration laws may be prone to non- compliance: people may view them more as bureaucratic inconveniences than as binding laws. At the least, this potential non-compliance with registration laws argues for more severe legislation.

C. Licensing
Legislation requiring licensing would restrict assault weapon possession to certain individuals. While it is conceivable that handguns may be needed for self-defense (and consequently that a license might be granted for that purpose) it is difficult to make the same claim for most semiautomatic weapons in a nation where other types of firearms are readily available. If high powered semiautomatic weapons are necessary for self defense, then it is difficult to explain why the police do not regularly carry those weapons or even fully automatic ones. [58] Most feel that the potential danger is simply too great. In reference to TEC-9 semiautomatic assault guns, Leroy Martin, Superintendent of Police in Chicago said, "they are not even in our arsenal because of the [Page 498] hazard they present to innocent people." [59] Thus, an assault weapon license should be granted only in rare circumstances.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike'

Anonymous said...

Yes Mikey they mean bidness when they say they will fight to keep their defense weapons (that you label with the misnomer of assault weapon).
Collectivism leads to concentration camps, leader worship, and war.~ George Orwell (even that ultra-librul recognized it Mikey!)

Anonymous said...

533.. Ive heard for four years what a wonderful person he is. How much of his time was donated to public service but all I can remember is the fact he moved back here and tried to buy an election three times. He even got married to mask what he really is all about. The mayor of Watertwon on this blog completely backed him so I just wondered what he had done along the lines of what he promised..
Possibly he will move one of his businesses up here in NNY and not run it for a loss but instead just to break even and give us stupid NNY people a job..
Thanks but I think we do just fine with a classy guy with integrity like Mr Owens... Of course Matt might run again if Owens passes away or retires.. Who else have the GOP got with that kind of money.

Anonymous said...

Here is the truth about "arming" teachers or ev en school staff. First, nobody really wants to shoot someone. Second, the armed people would have to go at least four time a year to a shooting range to keep their marksmanship skills current or they will be shooting holes in walls, floors, ceilings and the wrong people! When the issued guns begin to disappear as people retire is another issue. Keep it simple; The Sandy Hook shooter blew a glass door open. Replace all school doors and arm staff with tasers!

Anonymous said...

We were wondering just how long it would take for you, Mikey, to figure out the man's name who provided the space for the forum. As with every other issue you bloviate about, don't you think you should get some facts straight before you blow gas?

Dan Francis said...

How can proud gun owners, that is those who brag about their guns, now be so upset when people know they have a gun ...

Oh, I see, those notices give criminals a heads up and thus they will not be robbed ...

Nothing like surprise, surprise, right (you figure out what I mean).

Anonymous said...

Danny is a proud party line liberal democrat that pays no taxes on his pension but he doesn't ever admit to it. Yet he thinks gun owners should be happy with a newspaper trying to pull a fast one with freedom of information act?

Danny, how is it that the ADA requires people with disabilities to be allowed to take service animals anywhere in public but it is against the law to ask what their disability is?

I will tell you why. Because libruls are cowardly hypocrites, that's why. (you figure out what I mean).

Anonymous said...

I would like to see an open data base that tells us who gets their property taxes paid for by their neighbors. And who gets free healthcare while they advocate for ObamaCare for everybody else. And an open data base listing whose retirement is not taxed even thought they push for their fellow citizens to have their taxes increased for the good of the nation. Hey Dannie, what do you think of this? Do you think PROUD shirkers who get all this FREESTUFF should have their names posted on the internet? I didn't think so.

The latest on this is prisoners and criminals are making note of the personal addresses of law enforecement personnel who have weapons permits and are using this info to threaten officers. But this wouldn't effect you either, would it Dannie? No worries? You get all hysterical when someone mentions GOLF COURSE, let alone your actual address. PUKE

Anonymous said...

Hey MCM if no one has assault weapons then the police will gladly give up theirs? Will Obama and the King of NY give up there armed guards everywhere they go?? If they agree to I'll think about it, PS there still selling the assault weapons at the Ft. Drum PX.

Anonymous said...

Lets not forget, criminals will also no , which people have no wapons so they are easy targets for robberies.

The clerk did the right thing to refuse, to give out personal data.

This are law abidding citizens, who applied for permits , why should they be in the newspaper anyway?

I will add to the list of some of the commentators in the Thread:
How about printing the information of people who abusing welfare or Dissability Programs like Foodstamps, Section 8 or SSI?

Ironie off

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...


Let the Police keep their Assault rifles, so they can deal with scum like you, when they come to take yours away -- real sooooon!!!!

Mike Flynn 'Midle Class Mike'

Anonymous said...

Hey MCM the possession of a CCW went to the Supreme court and states had to either declare a , "May Issue" or Will issue state.

Jeff said...

I believe since the tax paying public pays the salaries of public workers...we should know how much they are being paid. I agree with the Putnam County clerk refusing to give up the list of LAWFUL gun permit he stated, just because it is a law, does not make it right! I believe this to be the same case when CONGRESS was doing INSIDER trading and getting rich off it.....once again just because it is legal....does not make it MORALLY right!
BTW, MCM, criminals do not follow laws,,,just so you know.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...

ANON 9:53

We have more people behind bars in America - over 2,000,000 because they don't follow rules and most of the time when they break those rules it’s committing an armed robbery. They're often holding Assault weapons or other guns with High Capacity Clips that was obtained illegally. Let's just give 'Gun Control' a chance and see if violent crime goes down like it does in other countries. In any case Gov. Cuomo today laid out the case for the toughest ‘Gun Control’ in the nation and he'll make it stick. Assault Rifles and high capacity clips are soon to be illegal to sell and likely to eventually even own.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class

Anonymous said...

MCM what exactly is "most" that you speak of? Now if you were a victim of an Armed Robbery wouldnt you want a way of protecting yourself? And what does "likely" mean in the last sentence? But I digress So here's the question what happens to my rifle which is a semi-auto which was bought legally with no Large Magazine, It's on the proposed Banned list I bought it legally through a dealer.....Should I give it up? (To who) Sell it now for a huge profit? One more thing MCM It has nothing to do with hunting and all to do with the 2nd ammendment. Please Call Cuomo to find out.

Mike Flynn 'Middle Class Mike' said...


It's over Rover, 'Gun Control; is here to stay - Bring in a Billion dollars and try to unseat Gov. Cuomo - you won't and he's going to make this the toughest 'Gun Controlled' State in America. So why bother to keep taling about it? You lose, 'Gun Contro; is jere amd it's staying here. I've been trying to set you straight on which way the wind was blowing for monts -you didn't hear me, and now you're all on a crying jag, I'm bored, take your 100,000 new NRA members and compare them to the 20 million people who are on board with the Gov. Cuomo's program. Do the math --you lose. Get it now.
Yikes, am I tired of talking to people like you. MCM

Anonymous said...

I also reiterate the question...where is Matt Doheny now? He hadn't volunteered in NNY or really engaged in the community in any way prior to running for office but we cut him some slack since he didn't live here. Then when he was actually running for office for the three years he did live here we continued to cut him slack since he was totally consumed with campaigning. Ok, so as the poster said, all of that is done now and where is he? He said he wanted to serve, but did he mean he wanted to serve only if it was from a position of power and prestige, like Congress? He is a household name now, why not put it to good use? Volunteer for a charity. Get involved in Toys For Tots. Fundraise for the hospital he broke ground on. Be an activist for political or social positions. Anything. Was he just pretending to care about the community to get elected and since he didn't he feels no need to step up and engage? I am beginning to believe he fed me and other voters a bunch of lines during the election and now I feel hoodwinked. I truly believed he was committed and actually cared but he has completely disappeared.

What ever happened to his company? When he first launched it he said he was working on hiring a person and establishing a company website but neither of those ever happened either. Was the company just a ruse to make him appear like a local?

I am clearly very disappointed in the man I thought would have been a good congressman for us all. Thank god for unanswered prayers, I guess, as his true colors are really showing through now.