The subsidies keep on coming for an industry that doesn't seem to make sense economically...Another wind farm in Lewis County will get tax breaks even though the current one near Lowville has had trouble making its payments.
The greening of America is not coming cheap but for rural towns that haven't seen new assessed valuation in years, the cut rate payments are enticing....Free money..just like the stimulus...
Watertown Daily Times PILOT proposed for new wind farm project
19 comments:
The ones who really benefit: Spain and their 'imported' companies who manufacture those windmills...
PILOTS are bad enough and I am basically against all PILOTS, but those that benefit foreign companies just adds to the misery, IMV.
But Dannie, your man in the White House has photos of wind towers behind him every time he makes a energy statement. This stuff, and the PILOTS that go along with them, are a central part of his program to combat gloooobal waaaarming and other issues important to the nose ring crowd. How can we, I mean you, have it both ways? Does this mean you support the Great One's nuke free, drill free, oil free, coal free, big bad company free, gas free, free stuff energy policy?
I doubt if you mean that. You and Wiley. You love wind, just not near you. Unless of course you had some land.
Monkey See
I've said it before, i'll say it again; I , myself, am not against wind power, but I am against the Pilots ,that accompany them. There are no needs, to curry special favors,from the mutlinational corporations, to build wind towers. The big businesses need to pay thier fair share of the taxes,like small businesses and everday people, do. How many people have seen a direct reduction in thier electric bills? If you increase your use, they raise the rates; if you reduce your usage,they raise the rates again,claiming too much conservation. In the meantime, they (the companies) want reduced taxes. See the benefit here, a companies bottom line. So where does that leave us, the taxed enough people? The big companies are going to wind up holding the people hostage; with-holding payments, crying poverty, taking us to court,(we do not have the money to fight them). The only thing I see in Pilots, is greed by the big companies and those that support them.
Au contraire, Mr Aldritch, there wouldn't even be wind factories if your federal gov't didn't subsidize them. The reason? Because there is no intrinsic value in industrial windmills. Ontario sites ran at about 30% capacity last year and that is on the high end of expectation. Vestas and the other generator builders say the life of one is about 12-15 years. But in all his wisdom, D Alexander gave Upstate power a 20 year pilot. Find a wind facility that beats 30% production WITHOUT subsidies. Right now, the hourly demand of 14,518 MW in Ontario is made up of 605 MW from wind. That's 1/24th of the demand. The price of a kWh is $.0345, but the Ontario system operator PAYS THE WOLFE ISLAND WIND farm $.09. The new offshore facility of about 200 wind towers (off Wolfe Island) will be paid 18.5 cents / kWh, or about 6 times the going rate. Plus around $10/rated MW.
4:21 , I know what you are saying, my point is, yes, I know our govenment is subsidizing the windpower projects, with our tax money; but still these companies then come directly to the citizens, and want more tax reductions; and you cannot convince me that this process isn't more than greed. Otherwise , if a project was a born loser from the beginning,never destined to make money ,who would want to be in the business? But, I do appreciate your knowledge on this controversial subject. And yes I agree, Don Alexander certainly does not appear to be very smart on th pilot; but he was greedy enough to do it.
Dear Monkey Butt,
Your partisan tail is showing...again. The subsidies for wind power didn't beging with Obama and Patterson. Remember the windfarm in Lewis County? One of the main tax subsidy laws passed for windpower in New York was passed about 2004 with the Lewis County project in mind. Who was the governor then-why yes, Monkey Butt, you're right, Pataki. Oh yeah, Dubya was President and the Dems didn't even have control of Congress. Nice try at partisanship- it is your strong suit. Oh and by the way, how's that drilly-spilly thing going for you and the other climate change deniers.
Alexander reeled in a $1.2 million fee for JCIDA, then somehow in the next breath found a buyer for the paper mill that all the revenue was drained out of, and is "recusing himself" from another EZ or PILOT decision for the prospective buyer. When does this farce end??
Alexander reeled in a $1.2 million fee for JCIDA, then somehow in the next breath found a buyer for the paper mill that all the revenue was drained out of, and is "recusing himself" from another EZ or PILOT decision for the prospective buyer. When does this farce end??
Dannie, I should have known, it was Dubya's fault. He was the one who started this entire deal of tax breaks for this and that and whatever. Wasn't it you, Dannie, who argued for tax breaks for vets like yourself a short time ago so you wouldn't have to pay Watertown city property taxes? But we shouldn't have tax breaks to encourage companies to help save us from what Al Gore tells us will be the end of the world as we know it? Can it possibly be more important to give you more free stuff than it is to save us all from such calamity? Why shouldn't you pay your taxes just like everybody else? I know, you earned all your free stuff. And the problem is not you and your entitlement mentality, the problem is everybody else. They just don't appreciate the value of having a retired federal employee in their midst. Shame on all of us.
About the drilly spilly thing. You might know the answer to this. Why did it take the Great One so long to get help down to the Gulf when this oil spill was obviously such a serious matter? Could it be he was too busy telling stories about the Arizona immigration law to notice the impending environmental disaster? Remember when GW did'nt funnel money to New Orleans fast enough to suit you needy people the crying we heard from people like you? You can never get enough, fast enough. But I wander..
Instead of giving tax breaks to you to pay your city property taxes, I think we should give them to energy companies trying to save the planet. I proudly proclaim gloobal waaarming should have taken priority over giving you another tax break. My environment is at least as important to me, my children and my dog as your financial needs.
Izzy Spitz
Republican
We can't afford tax breaks for billionaires and corporate wellfare - the likes of which are supported by Ken Blankenbush. Regardless of what the feds do - vote for local officials that won't do stupid "stuff" so we can at least be smart in our backyard. Ken and Don sold out their own neighbors for turbines made in china and higher power prices - let's remove the local bad actors at election time.
The approximate $300MM in subsidies for just the galloo island project will have no impact on the use of foriegn oil and will actually increase reliance on burning coal due to the way large scale wind operates in the grid. Do you have any idea what can be achieved with $300MM? How about insulation of homes and buildings and the conversion of oil burning heat to nat gas, propane and/or biomass? That alone would create more payroll and have bigger one year impact in energy independence and efficiency than the whole life of the galloo project. Or how about deploying a fleet of electric govt vehicles that charge their batteries from Oswego nuclear or NYPA hydro power? Or how about upgrading our small hydro fleet across upstate ny or deploying a fleets of farm dory digestors to make distibuted power in a way that saves our ag industry? Any one of these (which are just scratching the surface) make more energy, economic and employment sense than buying 200mm dollars of tubines from china for a dog of a project? Definity start to replace the local dumb dumbs with people that want to be smart and make a real difference.
Correct me if I am wrong, but the windfarm LEGALLY withheld the money because N.Y. State tried to SCREW THEM BY BACKING OUT ON THEIR AGREEMENT with the wind farm. You can't blame the wind farm people for being reluctant to forward the rest of the money until they are assured that the State of N.Y. isn't going to do it to them again next year. Hydro power is still cheaper than wind power, but I would expect wind power is cheaper than oil powered electricity.
Hey 9:06 you hit the nail on the head, Various well connected folks get on these boards, then as if by magic or trickery there able to tap into cheap interest loans for their businessess, It's a shame nothing is done by the county to reel in these abuses, But it ain't gonna happen.
911 You askforgo be corrected so here you go - you are wrong on all counts and wind is one of the most expensive forms of power - do some reading - duh
911- there IS NO OIL POWERED electricity !!! When will you hillbillies get that through your heads?
I think everybody needs to get real here. Subsidies for wind? Undeniably. But do you think that there are none for oil? Oil is notorious for special tax breaks and subsidies.
The real issue about wind is "should it be built where it is planned to be built" and is it being applied right.
By being applied right, it has long been my position that instead of large windfarms, windpower should be promoted using small towers for "off grid " use for businesses, farms and coops or partnerships of consumers.
Energy? We need to get back to more conservation. We are not "entitled" to gobble up energy and expect more.
Now Monkey Butt, you clearly are an angry, resentful, partisan type. The facts are coming out and it is becoming clear that Obama's Administration acted appropriately and timely.
As for Dubya and the subsidies, I'm just telling you the facts. Lewis County's project began when Pataki was Governor and benefits for wind power were created during that time. That's what attracted the investors and got this ball of wax rolling. Go ahead- deny reality- it's what you always do.
More on Dubya. This whole "drilly spilly" thing can be traced to his Big Oil friends. BP did not have the newest and best technology on the oil rigs that could have prevented this mess. Why? The deregulation/self regulation approach of the Bushies. Yeah, I know, nothing happened before Obama. Too bad for you Monkey Butt, the facts show otherwise.
One other thing. You have a strange obsession with Danny. You seem to find him everywhere. Maybe you should have that checked out.
This oil spill can be traced to Dubya and his friends? Right. As a partisan I would never have recognized that. I just see these folks who love wind when the Great One is blowing about it, then hating it when its nearby, as hypocrites. Its a simple thing, not too complicated.
And 10:02, me, angry, resentful, of what? No comprendo.
I'm to a point in my life where I'm getting everything checked out, so maybe I'll take your advice and get my "strange obsession" with Dannie checked out too. With Obamacare, all that stuff is free. Praise be.
Gunther Toody
10:13 - turn off Limbaugh and grow up...
~ finis
Not much of a comeback for being called a hypocrite, Danford. There is no substance to that statement. And I am a man who respects substances.
Mr Toody
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